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I would venture a guess that most everyone who reads the Daily can deduce what this is, oh Ev1lone. I’m obviously not offering it to look “good”, but in the hopes of starting a brutally honest and personal discussion about what’s “real”. I simply can’t bear any more of the bullshit…

But your response to the post may exactly demonstrate my point, Evil. ALL of the outrageous accusations leveled at the people still here are either outright lies or gross mis-characterizations designed to undermined the reputation and operations of the Pad. The sad fact is that a LOT of the people still “with” the Pad are still VERY much concerning themselves with some who have left (or more accurately vice versa), and the year of scurrilous mud-slinging that many on the team that produces the show have had to endure has had a devastating emotional and operational effect on us. It’s easy to dismiss such venom as the typical rantings of the blogosphere leveled against celebrities, but nobody understands just how hard it is to go on live cam and respond to this bullshit.

This post has nothing to do with Trent’s firing and no one has EVER accused me of sexually assaulting or harassing them. It was offered as a piece of physical evidence to help people who have heard the gossip understand an incident a few years ago (that you yourself referenced previously) of admittedly shocking indiscretion on my part, and how that incident has been used by Landon and his henchmen as a weapon. I am perfectly willing to have a open and honest dialog about the perils of engaging in sex for money for both parties, but I think that is a discussion for a later day. THIS discussion is about starting to chip away at the lies and treachery that have been aimed at the Fratpad over the last year. It is precisely the authentic interaction that everyone seems to treasure about the Pad that makes THIS discussion necessary.

And you’re going to have to try harder to offend me, Evil. It’s the honesty and reasonable nature of your arguments that allows me to trust having this discussion in the first place. You might even get to call me out on some of MY bullshit… 😉 (I know, I know. Opine is a verb… I fixed it)

HostmasterJohn

[ Editorial Note: The identities of individual performers involved in incidents that have not been officially or publicly announced are being protected intentionally. Posts or comments that reveal these identities will be edited or removed. ]

John, I assume you thought because you obscured the performers real name, you protected his privacy, but in reality we know who it was. If I were you, I would take it down, as it was presumed to be a private text conversation. Whether or not names appear, it was private. I am guessing he wouldn’t appreciate it being posted.

I spent a considerable amount of time thinking about that before I posted this Donnyboy, and if anyone does indeed know his identity as you say, I assure you that I am not the one who has violated his privacy. That’s precisely one of the main points I’m hoping to make by posting it. My only concern for him would be the impression the exchange gives about his relationship with his girl, because I didn’t find those statements to be consistent with what he said to me in person. I found him to be one of the sweetest, most genuine kids I’ve come across, but that doesn’t really matter, does it? Nobody’s supposed to even know who I’m talking about.

[ I want to add a clarification here regarding my concern for the impression his comments about his girlfriend leaves. Because no one besides the two of them knows the exact details behind his text comments, my additional observation was directed solely at her. If he is still with her, and she has been subjected to the probably painful analysis of this event, I would want her to know that he made statements to me at another time that contradict them. ]

john trent was one of the regulars i actually watched. could you please provide an answer on his leaving

Jostopa, I find it a little odd that after spending so much time watching his shows, you wouldn’t have heard that he has been talking about leaving for a while now. That is certainly what he has been saying to everyone around the house, and we just decided that now would be a good time for him to leave. He’s had a great run at the FRATPAD and we all wish him well.

But someone voluntarily leaving and someone being fired (term you used further above when you said “this post has nothing to do with Trent’s firing”) are two different things. My hunch is that is why jostopa is asking.

I said firing in response to a comment EvilOne666 had made right before mine, but I didn’t mean that to infer his departure was “for cause”. And I should make more clear that when I said “we” in my response to jostopa above, I meant the entire management team which technically would make it a termination. No drama though. 🙂

you’re right andy Will trent do a goodbye show ? WOuld be a good thing for his fans to say goodbye?

WOW… Does it get any easier. I was crushed when Kippers was let go, not so crushed about the incident with HMJ since i too- would be angry, but now hearing Trent, my superman of the pad GONE. wtf is going on at that PAD? Talk about Drama…. The Pad makes West Hollywood look bad when it comes to this topic.

It is frustrating – especially when fratmen seem to just disappear from the schedule. I’ve asked twice on the Daily and once in an email to Zane about the status of Schmit and received no response. I’m left to assume, at this point, he’s no longer part of the pad. Better communication is still needed.

There’s absolutely nothing wrong with paying for sex. I have definitely paid for sex before and will do so again in the future. However I do not and would not pay an employee for sex. In my opinion that is sexual harassment. Nor would I ever under any circumstances relay a private text conversation on a public blog. In court sure, on a private blog, well I simply have more class than that.
Lastly this conversation does not in any way prove the sex was consensual. Sorry HMJ but I could beg you for sex on camera, via text, or on the phone. I still have the right to say no at any moment. I am not saying that is what happened. Just feel it is important to note that any individual has the right to say no, no matter what they say in a text message. Changing ones mind at the last minute is perfectly acceptable.

I’m glad to see your input here again Ariel. I think your comment may have touched on all three of the points I was trying to make when I posted those texts originally.

Firstly, I never intended to offer them as proof of consent (the text that I Tweeted to demonstrate that Landon has been lying about systematically poaching our performers is a better example of “proof”), but rather as an actual example of a typical series of conversations, to allow people who had heard about the incident in question to form an opinion about its nature. The prevailing narrative being wielded against me is that I am a predator, using my influence as the owner of the company to coerce virtually all of the performers to engage in sex for money, or worse, sex for work or promotion, and this incident provides a convenient opportunity to allow people to consider what has really been going on. There appears to be a consensus that the texts clearly show not one, but a series of rendezvous over a period of time and most importantly, I think, at least one after the incident (that has since been made public) in which I did act inappropriately. And while I know that the texts certainly can’t demonstrate what happened during these meetings or the motivations of either parties that led them to occur, there has been general agreement that the tone and repetitive nature of the texts makes the engagements appear, at the very least, consensual.

Secondly, the texts hint at the fact that it was actually Landon (Leo) who was making the decisions about casting and supervising the performers at the time. And while a subordinate employment relationship would certainly not be required in this situation to have it constitute sexual harassment or assault, I have been exceptionally careful since the beginning to try to make clear a distinction between the two types of work for everyone involved. Up until shortly after the Pad moved to Arizona, I had extensive and very personal discussions with Landon about this very subject, in an attempt to assuage my own concerns, and to minimize any negative effects my actions might have on operations. At the time, I thought that Landon was unusually curious about all the details, but I can’t say now whether that was fore-shadowing of the treachery he has engaged in since he left the Pad, or simply an attempt to explore his discomfort with his own sexuality. Which brings me to my third point…

NONE of this information, including the discussion of particular events, would be public if it weren’t for Landon’s betrayal of my confidence and trust in him to keep our conversations about these matters private. Even the incident I reference in the texts, in which my appallingly bad behavior and indiscretion allowed another employee to witness something first-hand, would never have seen the light of day but for his urging. Certainly none of the participants would have any reason or desire to talk about it, least of all any of the performers involved. And apparently I need to remind everyone that the identity of the other party in those texts is being protected here. It could be Pee-Wee Herman for all anybody knows. If it weren’t for the publication of the discussion of the incident itself on Ben’s Blog or Landon’s second-hand account during one (several?) of his live shows, nobody would have any idea what the fuck I’m talking about.

HMJ Thank you for the reply. I’m never quite sure how to perceive you. I’ve made my feelings quite clear so I won’t rehash. I am confused however. Leo has not in anyway displayed confusion or discomfort about his sexuality. Your point was well made till that low blow. Just maybe you both are slingling a lot of stuff. Is it not possible to be the bigger man and let this feud drop?

It wasn’t meant as a low blow Ariel, because I’m not implying that Landon is struggling with discomfort about hidden feelings of same sex attraction, quite the opposite. Landon had often expressed great discomfort with the idea of personally engaging in same-sex behavior, and I haven’t yet been able to reconcile what role those feelings play in his work. This isn’t a feud. I’m just trying to get him to stop fucking with us so we can get back to work.

And I’m hoping your continued participation in this discussion is going to help you arrive at a more accurate perception. 😉

ariel, there is a difference, this is a porn site, hmj is not running a church choir. Would you say the same thing to jcruise or that Rob navaho dude. I would take what leo said with a grain of salt, the man is a disgruntled employee just looking to piss john off. In those text messages, maybe I missed it, I didn’t see an agreement on cash for sex. perhaps you can quote it for me ?

Jostopa, I do not think it’s the same. Both sites are vastly different than fratpad. Models show up to have gay or straight sex with another individual. That is traditional porn. It matters not who the other individual is. Fratpad is what it is because it’s not that. If you can’t see the difference than there really is no point in us having a conversation on the subject.

I agree with jostopa that the standard of appropriate sexual behavior should be different between a porn site and a church choir, but I don’t think that relieves companies that produce adult-content from the responsibility of fair and ethical behavior when it comes to sex with/between employees. Not Jake Cruise, not Hugh Hefner, not me.

I’m also not sure where this is coming from, as I haven’t heard anything. It seems to have stirred though!

If anyone is curious about the law in cyberspace: 13-1406. Sexual assault; classification; increased punishment – A. A person commits sexual assault by intentionally or knowingly engaging in sexual intercourse or oral sexual contact with any person without consent of such person. (Fyi – it doesn’t matter if alcohol or drugs were consumed/present or not, if people are black out drunk or not).

I am not for one second saying the above reference is to be used in this situation, however I think people have forgotten what sexual assault actually is and can be.

I am reminded of an incident that took place in 7th grade on the bus going to school. My best friend Brian decided to rip up some strips of the flooring from the bus floor. He then decided to throw it at someone. Well the teacher, Mrs. B, saw it flying through the air out of the corner of her eye. She looked at me and she said, “when we get to school you go straight to the principals office, and you have detention for three days.” I remember as if it were yesterday. She completely blamed me for something I never did. She marched me to the principals office, and I got detention – once again for something I didn’t do. Well later that day my friend Brian did finally come forth. Mrs. B. told me, “You know what got you in trouble? Because of your reputation and you are generally always the guy that does do it. You have earned your reputation young man so live with those consequences. Only you can change it!” She never once apologized to me for her mistake. But that taught me something so valuable. Reputations for the most part are earned, unfortunately! HMJ, I am not saying you have earned this type of accusation, but I am saying when one hires for sex, or gives drugs to friends, etc… then that reputation is earned – and often times the consequences of those decisions can affect future accusations even if not founded.

Trust me I am not innocent. I have hired once in Vegas of all places haha that guy was so hot, the sex was so hot, until he stole my laptop, wallet, work briefcase, etc… it was a challenge flying home with no ID lol…

OK Doc, now let me get this straight. Was Mrs. B blaming you unfairly for ripping up the bus flooring and hurling it through the bus at a classmate (when it was actually your best friend Brian who had done the deed) because you had earned a reputation for such skulduggery unfairly, or was she blaming you unfairly for the crime because you had actually been a naughty boy on numerous previous occasions and failed to change your behavior in order to improve the reputation that she was using to accuse you?… unfairly.

HMJ, I had absolutely earned that reputation! As unfair as her assessment was, it taught me that our actions and decisions often times have consequences even when not earned. My previous actions and decisions put me in a position of being accused of something I did not do.

In that case Doc, your story actually reinforces my position. The evil forces (sorry EvilOne) that have been waging a “war” against the FRATPAD (under the direction of General Elengold and with the support of a variety of sociopathic scum), have been painting a picture of the company and me personally that cannot be supported by the facts. Landon has been dangling (and finally publicly revealed) this story as evidence that I have engaged in systematic sexual harassment of virtually all of the performers who come to the Pad, and I started a discussion about this particular incident to allow the people who had been exposed to that lie to form an opinion based on what actually happened. My misbehavior that night had nothing to with accusations of sexual misconduct, but rather that I got blackout drunk in a situation that allowed a performer to accidentally discover me and another performer making out. The incident (related to me later, of course) also had me, among other things, at one point urinating in the public parking garage, and it was behavior about which I was, and remain, profoundly embarrassed. It was behavior that had never occurred up to that point, has not occurred since, and as sure as I can possible be about anything, will never happen again. But as your story about you and Mrs. B goes, it’s not fair to use unearned reputation to demonstrate guilt, and unless you read the text and see coercion, you see sex-for-money AS sexual-misconduct, or you are making a case that the performer was harassing ME because I was incapacitated by alcohol, it’s not fair to use even this incident to support a “reputation” that I’m a predator. The real question is why anyone would be trying to do that in the first place.

HMJ, I absolutely believe you may well have been the victim in this situation. That performer clearly had the upper hand, he was in his right mind – you were not! In fact, I have seen a side of you that some have not. I have seen you come to the aid of fratmen in need, that could have cost you personally – a lot of money! But there is a reputation brewing, that you have paid employees/independent contractors for sex and that you have provided drugs. If this isn’t true I would love to hear that. I have never judged due to those actions, as I have seen your compassion. However, none of this is our business at all – what happens between two consenting adults, is that just… Being accused of something you did not do sucks…

Doc, I’m not entirely sure that you and I are hearing the same rumors or even that we are reading the same post, because this post is about my admission of a pay-for-sex arrangement with a performer (I’ve never denied any of that), in order to refute the persistent blather of lies that I’ve been sexually harassing all the performers. My suggestion that the young man had sexually-harassed me was an apparently feeble attempt at sarcasm. I suggested earlier that we save the discussion about the perils/benefits of pay-per-sex arrangements for another day, but I’m satisfied that I’ve made my strongest argument possible here to lay the sexual harassment nonsense to rest.

That being said (and I hesitate starting this in this post), why don’t you tell me a little bit of the gossip about me giving performers “drugs” and the effects of my supposed action.

“Unfairy” … teehehe. 😉

John, no matter how this war of words plays out, one true thing will outlast every argument: You are one of the authentic geniuses of American male erotica. Your eye for beauty and standards of excellence created a kind of ideal that evoked the heady heyday of the Hollywood dream factory. Has any homegrown pornographer ever made men look so DELECTABLE? Your art, like William Inge’s, is rooted in a deep longing gay men have in this country for an all-American boy, the boy-next-door (if you lived on Frat Row), the str8-male correlative to Hugh Hefner’s bunny-centerfold, the one you ache for for but can’t touch, which is why s(he) comes with stapled pages & a jar of lube.

Like so many artists, however, you confuse your vision of the world with the world you’re trying to escape, the one that’s the opposite of everything you adore: It’s ugly, untrained, spiteful, envious and covetous — it wants what you have, artistically and financially. It’s not your fault you couldn’t see the coming collision. Not everybody can be Melanie Griffith in Working Girl: “I have a head for business and a bod for sin.”

Out of the endless catalog of your presumed errors in business and propensity to sin, only one matters, and it happened early: Letting the lunatics run the asylum — or, in your case, hiring hustlers to run the doghouse (male equivalent to cathouse). It’s instructive that Hefner handed over the management of his empire not to a couple of dumb bunnies, but to his DAUGHTER. Couldn’t you have procreated just once, John? Pussy ain’t poison, ya know! (just looks like it).

Your desire to mold men in your image — trying to turn guttersnipes & sex workers into artists & heirs, SONS — reflected your aesthetic impulse to mold an image OF men. You couldn’t tell one from the other, and you couldn’t see what these guys really were; you had to believe they were YOU. On the one hand, it was an indication of your vanity, a congenital flaw in every artist, but on the other, it was proof of your naivete, your touchingly foolish belief that you could take the muses of your work and make them replicas of humanness that would provide the love and trust and family that art can’t.

There isn’t a gay man alive — not one with a brain and a heart, anyway — who doesn’t understand this predicament, and yet your most vociferous foes routinely crucify you for being, well, gay & gifted. Gay people hating other gay people is especially intense in gay-4-pay land, partly because the “str8” models are made sacred, off-limits. That’s why the other blog, as I like to call it, combines the creepy fandom of Kathy Bates in Misery with the vengeful fury of a lynch mob. It’s a lynch blog! What I find most repellent is its thunderous stupidity — the bad grammar, bad spelling, bad writing, relentless repetitions, like a literary Tourette’s Syndrome.

At the same time, these depressing hacks can’t seem to wrest their noses from the gym-toned glutes of your most ambitious offspring. A poseur, an egotist, a heterosexual hustler & a wannabe thug-4-life, Landon has taken your “business model” — i.e. artistic vision — and degraded it into a carnival of over-muscled closet cases shaking gay men’s wallets for spare change. That’s what happens when you think a business model IS an artistic vision, when a straight “entrepreneur” tries to ape the talent of a gay aesthete (In all these years, Landon hasn’t developed a single signature feature as a filmmaker; everything he does he borrowed from you).

As for you being a Chris Hansen refugee, the charge is ludicrous, considering the environment. Hefner, for example, must have banged thousands of girls wandering through the Playboy mansion looking for jobs & not once has anybody resorted to all that pious cant about “employer-employee relations” and “appropriate office behavior.” In fact, Hefner is universally ADMIRED as a cocksman. Why? Because straight sex is cool, and gay sex is “evil, disgusting, revolting” — you know, all those things the other blog calls you (me, us) on an hourly basis. You shouldn’t be so defensive on this point — your enemies are just jealous & that the source is coming from Landon is a scream: Imagine what HE’D do in house full of Hef’s hotties.

Besides, wasn’t Marilyn Monroe having sex with a series of ogres on the way to the top overwhelmingly worth it — to her & to us — because it was her path to immortality? Isn’t that why we do anything — have children, create art, bother to talk at all — to leave some mark, find some meaning, be remembered? I don’t know what your future holds, John, but your past work is unassailable and secure. You have achieved a piece of immortality, and it is impervious, permanently, to all the mud that’s slung at it. Dirt turns to dust, and through the cloud, beauty shines.

Yikes, 2(x), that was a mouthful… really great stuff. I have been looking back lately at all of the beautiful imagery that has amassed to comprise FRATMEN over the years, and I am amazed and very proud of the body of work. I’m grateful too for all of the people (even the guttersnipes) 😉 who have helped me create it. I really appreciate your kind words.

Your insights about the workings of the beast fall surprisingly close to some ideas that I have been grudgingly realizing over the last few months regarding the turmoil of the last year. While I don’t think your “muses into heirs” analogy is as black and white as you envisage, there can be no doubt now that my naivety about the perils that that path has brought to the work has been a weakness. And your portrayal of Landon as a “hustler” struck a nerve. I’ve come to think of him simply as a con man or a slime-ball, but your characterization of him has added a nuance that I hope we can explore as this discussion continues to unfold.

But I think my biggest mistake so far has been not starting this discussion with all of you sooner. Everyone behind-the-scenes here has been drowning in a sea of anxiety and paranoia, assuming (obviously falsely) that the only voices to be heard were out to get us. The open and reasonable nature of the arguments of late (even from opposing views) has been VERY therapeutic.

2X could have taken the words right out of my mouth.

I also think the Hugh Heffner analogy is an apt one. Like Mr. Heffner, John created an iconic brand which captured (in this case beautiful young men) at the peak of their early desirability. The Playboy brand became a lifestyle brand with Hugh Heffner as its ultimate symbol, with the nearly universal envy and admiration of heterosexual men.

The incident described by John did not present him at his finest to be sure. But I frankly think it is time for John to stop feeling as though he has to apologize for enjoying the company of some of his models, or the lifestyle he has earned. Some of the encounters with his models may have been initiated by the models themselves, some by John, but why wouldn’t he enjoy their company if he has the opportunity?

The Fratmen brand is also to some extent a lifestyle brand. But unlike the Playboy brand, we get to participate in the lifestyle, albeit in a virtual way. We interact with some of these same young men. We form attachments, we talk with them about their lives, and are entertained by them in a uniquely personal way.

Whatever happens to the future of the Pad, there are some accomplishments which no one can ever take away from John. Before many other studios caught on, John created a website that captured in sumptuously beautiful photos and video some of the most amazing young men. The Fratmen brand is still considered by many the standard by which other like sites are measured. The FratPad created a (then) new concept of allowing the fans of his work to engage in the lives of some of those same stunning young men.

Like 2X I don’t know what the future holds. But I fully believe that the work already created by John and his team will be enjoyed by generations of gay men who follow us. If I had any advice for John it would be to not let the words or deeds those who envy him or what he has created, deter him from enjoying his accomplishments. And, this John may not like, but I want everyone who pursues a similar dream to be successful. I hold no antipathy toward anyone (of course I am sure I don’t know all of the behind the scenes drama and don’t want to).

John you are not perfect. But as it relates to relationships with some of your models: you have nothing to apologize for. You have helped some of them, some of the relationships were likely complicated and may have ended badly. That’s life. 2X said what I wanted to say much more eloquently than I, but there it is.

I look forward to more great things to come.

BOBBYV!!!!!!!!! … I miss you! I’m glad to see you chip in your 2 cents 🙂

I did want to add a comment to one of the things that you said Bobby, about whether I care or not if Landon is successful in his new venture. I’ve never felt that what Landon is producing has or will have any effect on us, because I haven’t found any of it to be very appealing. And why a high school graduate with seventh grade written communication skills would give up a $100k+ job to produce that crap and trumpet it as a success, is beyond me. The problem has always been that he has relentlessly continued to insert himself into my business by poaching current and former performers and employees (among other things) and then lying about it. I’m not going to stop talking about the details of the last year until he stops, and trust me, I’m just getting started. Besides, it’s a very interesting story.

And I hope you won’t mind Bobby, but I wanted to publicly thank you for the series of phone conversations we had in the period shortly after Landon left. You were one of a very few members that I was talking to at that time, and I took great comfort from them.

This is perhaps the best ‘blog’ conversation in the 1.8 years I have been here. HMJ – I agree with almost everything others have said. I have told you directly of your genius, and I completely believe that. I refuse to pay for porn, but yet I give you $30 per month. But this blog is not about your genius, it is about mistakes. It seems to me you really dropped a personal wall posting this. Perhaps a very difficult wall for you to cross. In humility people shine! And that is what I see here. So we are all adults here and I will just tell you of the rumors I have heard. Rumor #1: you pay employees for sex, and this has happened repeatedly over the years. Rumor #2: you have provided employees drugs at the parties you host, in AZ and in HI. Rumor #3 those drugs include pot, cocaine, mushrooms, among others. These rumors have been festering for years. I clearly don’t know you like the others do as I am a rather newcomer, and yet even I have heard these. I am not sharing this with any type of guilt-ridden trepidation – you asked – I shared! I have zero reason to judge anyone, therefore I don’t. I have supported you and the fratpad, and will continue to do so. And nor do I believe you need to comment on those rumors, I was just informing you. Maybe one day I will unzip my fly and we can discuss my mistakes – they are abundant!

I think this would be a good time to make a distinction between the two types of gossip because there is a significant difference between the two in how I perceive them. The nattering about my sex life is extremely troubling to me because it has a material and sometimes devastating effect on the people I work with and care about. The fact that Landon has lied or betrayed my confidence about that stuff in order to promote it and hurt me makes me the maddest I have been about anything he has done. The gossip about alleged drug use in my private life, I really couldn’t give a shit about. It truly isn’t anybody’s business.

That being said, the rumors about me supplying piles of drugs at my parties, particularly but not limited to cocaine, are a myth. The only intoxicants I have or would give to guests at a party would be alcohol or occasionally cannabis (because of my preference for it over spirits).

With all due respect, doc, this blog is about anything we choose to make it — it’s not just “about mistakes.” For that, we have Catholic confessionals, AA meetings and Dr. Drew. And if we’re going to start demanding that we dispel every scurrilous “rumor” about ourselves IN PUBLIC, we might want to ring Roy Cohn & Joe McCarthy to see if they’re still in business. In the meantime, please, PLEASE let’s show some sense about normal human behavior and get off our hobby horses about Sin & Repentance.

After all, Landon pointing fingers at anybody in this respect is, as the French say, to laugh. How many times — as a manager — did he show up on cam after a night of partying with a mysterious “head cold”? (Wish I had a nickel for every time that happened). And wasn’t it his own brother who used to boast on cam about going to a masseuse down the road who’d jerk him off for 80 bucks? (He urged other frats to take advantage of this lovely & affordable service). Now that’s one PRESUMED drug story & one OBVIOUS prostitution story. You wanna drag the Elengold brothers into court over it? Fine. But don’t ask me to come with you.

Let’s get real: We’re not talking about a dental office or a marriage bureau or a Popeye’s Chicken. We’re talking about a HOUSE OF PORN. I’m surprised there isn’t an illegal cache of Uzis in the kitchen cupboard and a half-dozen decomposing bodies in the basement. In that context, blowing the boss is getting off easy (pun unintended, but unavoidable). And let’s make the perspective clearer: We’re talking MAYBE a little hanky-panky or puff-puff or sniff-sniff, not murder or genocide or kidnapping or the Kardashians — though kidnapping the Kardashians IS an idea.

After all is said and done, none of this — and I mean none of it — is anybody’s goddamned business. I’m always stunned when people have passionate opinions about Brad & Angelina or Ashton & Mila or Miley & her wrecking ball. Me, I have no opinion — I never the met the motherfuckers! Just because somebody runs a blog or a rival business or pays a buck a day in membership fees does not entitle him to tell anybody else how to run his personal or professional life. If someone has charges to make, let him hire a lawyer and face a judge & jury. Otherwise … well, let’s keep it clean, ladies!

PS Hey, Bobby V, you’re plenty eloquent! Thanks for the shout-out.

2X I completely agree with you! However, HMJ did ask to hear what they are. Clearly if I believed the rumors I would not be a member. I actually considered emailing HMJ privately, but thought what the hell – he asked…

HMJ, I applaud this entire posting. I think its awesome and courageous, it has shown a vulnerable side of you that I appreciate and admire.

I am with Roger on a couple things. From a customer service perspective it would be great to hear your ideas of strategic planning. I would also love to hear what HMJ thinks about the future of the fratpad, industry trends, what has been his most awesome experience with the fratpad the past years, and perhaps difficult struggles.

Let me comment on my own post!!! What about The Daily interviewing HMJ on future plans, fun stories about the industry, etc…

This may not be the thread for this but here goes.

You know – I’m really just tired of all this – from both sites/camps. I have been a member since the site started and I did not stay all this time because I like to listen to the drama or finger pointing or “who did what to whom”. The only time any of this is of any interest to me is when it causes an interruption in the entertainment I am paying for. I’ll match any of you in loyalty to the Pad, but I am just about fed up with what has happened to the place. So, come on, someone tell me to pick up my marbles and go someplace else.

You want membership’s loyalty, then provide what we have come to expect and were promised. The amount of content has greatly diminished from around 25 to 28 hours a day to now 4 to 5 hours a day. No special events like FPF and a much smaller cast. Frats disappear from the schedule and no word is given on either the site or it’s blog as to why. I’m not asking for an explanation with explicit details, but even Kohl’s puts up a “Sorry this item is no longer available” on a sold out or discontinued item.

Why do we even listen to what any other blogs has to say? We all know that if HMJ found the cure to cancer it would get maybe a one line mention there, but if something negative happens it takes center stage for days and the comments are limitless. Articles about their main focus may garnish some comments, but usually in the single digits. Trash sells.

So please – get back to the basics. If the problem is management – get new management. If its content then look at worked in the past. If it’s location then move. Something needs to be done before the final death thrall is sounded. The membership fee is not going to break me, but I’m not going to continue to pay it if I’m getting very little in return from what I once did.

I’m sure I have not expressed myself as elegantly as others have but I hope my meaning has come through.

Still a loyal fan.

THAT’S the spirit Rog! I think you expressed your position very elegantly indeed, and I’ve never for a second questioned your loyalty to the FRATPAD.

I know this “feud” all seems like tit-for-tat on the surface but, I probably need to say again that it has posed significant emotional and operational difficulties for all of us behind-the-scenes. This frank discussion about it probably should have started a while ago, and while I can’t guarantee that the engagement won’t flare up again in the future, I’m satisfied that I’ve accomplished what I needed to when I posted here. Why don’t we head on over to A Changing FRATPAD Business Model so we all can figure out how we’re going to fix this mess.

I agree 100% with Roger. Stop the back and forth. As they say, it takes two to tango. Enough already.

Communication is key, and if members are kept up to date here, then there would be no reason to look at other sites to find out what is going on. That is the biggest joke of them all… that paying members here can not get any information until days later, and then it’s only posted here because of reports from other sites.

Very, very easy to fix.

Evidently, no one wants to fix it.

Hey Roger, great to hear from you! FPFs will be returning and the daily broadcasting hours will also increase once the new guys get settled into the Pad 😉 “Back to Basics” is actually a term we have been using a lot around here lately and this summer is looking like it’s going to be really great at the Pad 😉 -Zane

Zane, you are doing a wonderful job recruiting. Each guy was completely different from the other – ok ya and HOT… great job…

I have almost always agreed with Roger’s opinion and now is no different. Years of loyal membership, payment of dues and extra-cost perks, and offered “service” via the Founders has been rewarded with what we see at the Pad today. The listed “problems” are age-old and so familiar to members they can recite them by heart. The empty promises by management of “good things just ahead” are laughable if not so very, very tragic and seemingly so unnecessary. This site has one of the highest educational levels of its members of any site on the web. Their disposable income and willingness to contribute to “just causes” via gifts and money has been demonstrated over and again. The maintenance by management of the membership group falls somewhere beyond nonexistent and has been that way for the four and one half years I’ve been a member. The uniqueness of the Pad remains a constant which keeps members paying their dues each month and this entire concept has seemingly escaped the comprehension by management for a similar amount of time. The “voiced reasons” of why members remain by management are so far afield that no establishment deserves to survive with such abysmal understanding of their product and customer base. Roger and Tony’s meaning comes through loud and clear but the people who need to hear the words are sadly not listening and never, it seems, will they.

Jed, I’d hoped that the apparent care I’ve taken in constructing my comment here would convey that I’m listening to you all VERY! intently. Roger5 and I are heading over to A Changing FRATPAD Business Model to talk about the very points you are bringing up. Won’t you join us? 🙂

John,

Your comment was very professional. I don’t believe an individual in the PR field could have stated it better 🙂

#slap

PD

I gotta say: This is the most interesting group of posters since The Troubles began — doc, bobby v, evil, roger, all others & of course the incomparable John: My hat’s off to all of you!

I know 2x, isn’t it cool?! I LOVE hanging out with the smart kids. 😉

Dear God we must all meet for a weekend of coffee some day – I’m hosting in San Diego… No fuck that – HMJ is hosting at his penthouse… This would be more fun than a gay mens chorus weekend retreat…

Jed/roger: Of course, you’re right, but … I’m willing to give it a few months — the summer — to see what happens. The all-access fee I pay is more than any of the other 8 or 9 sites I subscribe to, but it’s not a crushing sum, so … let it ride & hope to hit it on the back end. Basically, I’m just gonna RELAX about the entire affair. After the winter we’ve had, I’m content to wait for a little heat.

I like the idea Doc- HMJ hosting a member sit in @ the pad. 🙂

I totally agree with Roger 5 – I’ve been around for awhile too. I seldom say anything, in chat or otherwise — I’m one of those members that because of work have to live in the archives. I pleaded for all the archives to come back for months — finally they are all back. It damn well took “forever”, but agreed – they are back. However, the current archives are minimal because ofcourse the Pad hours are minimal. Disregarding the archives, considering what the Pad USED to be — none of us are currently getting our money’s worth . I too love the Pad, and I’ll stick with it for awhile longer — but management had better “GET BACK TO THE BASICS” soon. And I too “am still a loyal fan”.

Honestly! Why the fuck is this even an issue. People act like this is something new that happens in the porn world. As it is said, ‘grow the fuck up!’. You are sturring up dramas for years ago. Fratmen will never reach the intended ‘new’, if keep bringing back the ‘old’. Stop being the stereotypical gays that are drama queens. Put the tiaras back in their boxes and on the top shelf in the closet, where they belong. Time to enjoy the Fratpad of the now. For those who endlessly complain and/or allege they are cancelling their memberships, STOP IT! Just STOP IT! You know you will continue to log in to gossip. It’s a known and proven fact. This behavior is why so many left the site. People are utterly disgusted with all the dramas, they cannot enjoy what they are paying for. Christ, even the so-called ‘free’ members stopped logging in. What does that tell you? That’s the ingredients for a ‘loyal’ member. Don’t like it, ‘get the fuck out … of the kitchen’.

The Daily has become more entertaining than a John Irving novel. I’ve just spent the last 20 minutes reading everyones comments. I appreciate the honesty from all and especially John. I’m also in agreement with Evil regarding the fact that most of what people have concerned themselves with is none of anyones business. Roger’s point that getting back to basics are spot on. I love what Zane puts out there and think he’s got some great ideas. I’m happy to hear that FPF and more shows are forthcoming.

My suggestion for responding to any future hateful comments is not to respond at all. Dignifying the accusations with a response only eggs on the accusers all the more. I appreciate John opening up, taking personal responsibility for some actions he regrets and offering his perspective but I don’t think he should feel obligated to humble himself any further. Let people rant if they must and just move forward doing the next right thing.

FPF (FratPad Forever)

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